DAVE DAVIES, HOST:
That is FRESH AIR. I am Dave Davies. Cissy Houston, the gospel singer and backup vocalist who guided her daughter Whitney Houston to stardom, died Monday on the age of 91. Cissy Houston started singing on the gospel circuit as a toddler. She additionally sang secular music. She carried out with The Candy Inspirations, the group that backed Aretha Franklin. And she or he sang backup vocals for Elvis Presley, Solomon Burke, Dusty Springfield, Wilson Pickett, Van Morrison, The Drifters and Dionne Warwick, who was her niece.
In a New York Instances obituary, Robert Darden, who wrote a number of books on gospel music, stated of Houston, she was a big determine not as a result of she offered a number of information however due to the folks she influenced who did promote lots and due to her work as a sustainer and nurturer of the gospel music custom. For greater than 50 years, Cissy Houston was the choir director for the New Hope Baptist Church in Newark, the place she received her begin as a singer. She endured the double tragedy of the demise of her daughter Whitney, who drowned in a lodge bathtub in 2012, and three years later the lack of her granddaughter and Whitney’s daughter, Bobbi Kristina Brown, who was discovered unresponsive in her residence bathtub and died shortly after.
Terry spoke with Cissy Houston in 1998. On the time, Houston had written her autobiography, “How Candy The Sound: My Life With God And Gospel.” They started with music from Cissy Houston’s Grammy Award-winning gospel album “Face To Face.” That is “God Do not Ever Change.”
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “GOD DON’T EVER CHANGE”)
CISSY HOUSTON: (Singing) God in all creation. God when Adam fell, Adam fell. God method up in heaven – good God Almighty, now – God method down in hell. Oh, He is God, He is God. God do not ever change. He is God – He is God, my God – at all times will likely be God. You see, He is spoken to the mountain – sure, He did, yeah – stated how nice I’m, I’m. Need you to stand up within the morning, youngsters, shift round like lambs. He is God, He is God. God do not ever change. He is God – He is God, my God – at all times will likely be God. He is God in your time of illness, in your time of illness. God is a health care provider, too. God is a health care provider, too. In your time of bother, He is actually a God to you. Hallelujah. Oh, He is God, He is God. God do not ever change. He is God – He is God, my God – at all times will likely be God, yeah.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR BROADCAST)
TERRY GROSS: Cissy Houston, welcome to FRESH AIR.
C HOUSTON: Thanks so very a lot for having me.
GROSS: So how outdated have been you while you began singing within the household group?
C HOUSTON: 5 years outdated. I used to be 5 years outdated, they usually needed to put me on a stool to be able to see me. And, in fact, at 5 years outdated, I wished to be out taking part in with everybody else. And it was sort of troublesome for me, however there was no query. I did not have a selection (laughter).
GROSS: It’s essential to develop an incredible ear for concord while you begin singing shut concord on the age of 5.
C HOUSTON: For certain. I actually did. And I choose it. I like, a number of instances, a cappella. That’s firstly in instructing, so far as I am involved, that the harmonies be proper.
GROSS: So how did you first begin listening to secular music? And who have been a few of the performers that you just first heard?
C HOUSTON: Nicely, Dinah Washington was one in all my favourite folks, and I like her. Right this moment, I like her. Sarah Vaughan went to high school with my sister, so she lived within the neighborhood additionally. I listened to her and Jimmy Witherspoon. I beloved him – B. B. King, you recognize, folks like that. The blues – I like the blues , issues like that.
GROSS: I might love to listen to the story of the way you turned a backup singer. I feel that Dionne Warwick pertains to this story. Dionne Warwick and her sister, Dee Dee, have been backup singers. And had you recognized them from church choir?
C HOUSTON: No, they’re my nieces.
GROSS: They’re your nieces.
C HOUSTON: Sure, they’re.
GROSS: Oh, oh, oh. Wow – small world.
C HOUSTON: Each of them are.
(LAUGHTER)
GROSS: So how does Dionne Warwick’s having been a backup singer relate to you having develop into one?
C HOUSTON: Nicely, really Dionne had one thing else to try this night time with The Shirelles, and my husband was managing them on the time.
GROSS: Managing The Shirelles or Dionne Warwick?
C HOUSTON: No, no, no, Dionne and her group, background singers – Dee Dee, Dionne and one other child, Sylvia. And he was managing them, and he had a session to do. And naturally, he could not cease her from going with The Shirelles. That was an incredible alternative for her. So he requested me would I do it? I stated, yeah, I will do it. You understand, I did not actually wish to as a result of I had simply had a child, like, a month earlier than that. However anyhow, I did. We wrapped up and went to New York. And at first, the man did not need – he wished to cancel the session. So my husband stated, properly, simply pay attention, you recognize, and whatnot, they usually did. And after that, they wished me. I completed an entire week with them. They wished me. They did not need – you recognize, did not wish to return. They appreciated the sound and all of that. And that is how I received began in it.
GROSS: After singing backup for some time, you ended up singing with Aretha Franklin as one in all her backup singers.
C HOUSTON: Yeah, properly, I labored with Aretha when she was at Columbia additionally, the sooner days earlier than she received to Atlantic, when she did some marvelous music. Simply wasn’t appreciated, I suppose, prefer it ought to’ve been. Then she got here to Atlantic, and yeah – and appeared like our paths met once more and wound up singing background for her, yeah, lots.
GROSS: And in your memoir, you say that one in all your favorites of the Aretha tracks is “Pure Girl,” and also you labored out the background elements on this. Are you able to inform us somewhat bit about how you probably did that, what you have been in search of?
C HOUSTON: Nicely, I do not know. You at all times, while you work out – I labored out background elements on a lot of the issues that I did. However “Pure Girl” was like, you attempt to meet – improve what she’s achieved, you recognize? And that is the purpose. That is the gist of doing backgrounds, to make it higher, you recognize? And a number of instances, backgrounds make songs and actually promote them. And I do not know the way I labored it out proper now (laughter). It was simply, you recognize, repeating and interested by, you recognize, doing one thing. And also you strive one factor, and that works or would not work. You strive one thing else.
GROSS: Now, did you provide you with the aah-oohs, or was {that a} producer who instructed that?
C HOUSTON: No, that was me.
GROSS: That was you.
C HOUSTON: Mm-hmm (ph).
GROSS: I at all times surprise, like, how are you aware what syllable to make use of? Like, why aah-ooh as a substitute of ooh-aah or ooh-aah-ooh or…
C HOUSTON: Neither do I. I do not know why. You strive the one which works, I suppose.
GROSS: Nicely, why do not we hear “Pure Girl, ” Aretha Franklin? Cissy Houston is without doubt one of the backup singers on this, and he or she did the vocal preparations, the harmonies.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “NATURAL WOMAN”)
ARETHA FRANKLIN: (Singing) When my soul was within the misplaced and located, you got here alongside to assert it. I did not know simply what was mistaken with me until your kiss helped me title it. Now I am not uncertain of what I am residing for. And if I make you cheerful, I needn’t do extra. Since you make me really feel, you make me really feel, you make me really feel like a pure lady, lady. Oh, child, what you’ve got achieved to me, what you’ve got achieved to me. You make me really feel so good inside, good inside. And I simply wish to be, wish to be near you. You make me really feel so alive. You make me really feel, you make me really feel, you make me really feel like a pure lady, lady. You make me really feel…
GROSS: That is Aretha Franklin with Cissy Houston, my visitor, as one of many backup singers. And she or he did the vocal harmonies for that monitor. Cissy Houston, did you are feeling a connection to Aretha Franklin via gospel music?
C HOUSTON: Considerably as a result of we each have been in gospel music, did the identical sort of, you recognize, factor, stirring sort of gospel. And, sure, I felt, like, a camaraderie along with her.
GROSS: And while you have been doing backup vocals for Aretha Franklin, did you discover that every part you wanted to know, you knew from gospel music, that the harmonies you have been utilizing got here out of gospel music?
C HOUSTON: Oh, certain. Oh, certain. One factor about us, we pushed each other. We’d simply, you recognize – we would feed off each other, which made it a terrific sound and such an incredible, you recognize, viewers participation. They only beloved it.
GROSS: Now, how would you file within the studio? Did you all sing on the identical time, or was every part overdubbed?
C HOUSTON: No, properly, generally we sang on the identical time. With Aretha, at that time, yeah, every part was overdubbed. On Columbia, now, we sang on the identical time. She sang in a sales space, and we have been in both possibly a sales space or outdoors with one thing else.
GROSS: What was your choice?
C HOUSTON: Nicely, sales space is sweet. And overdubbing is larger as a result of you may actually get a down sound, you recognize, good sound, steadiness and all that sort of enterprise. And issues that you just consider, you recognize, that may work higher on one thing, you do not have to keep it up, you recognize?
GROSS: What did you take pleasure in and what did not you want about singing backup?
C HOUSTON: I did not like? Something. You understand, I beloved singing background. I simply love singing it and love creating one thing and realizing the end result. And it was sounding nice and good. And we sounded good and nice, and most of all, it offered information (laughter).
DAVIES: Cissy Houston talking with Terry Gross in 1998. She was a gospel and backup singer for a lot of hits of the ’60s and ’70s, and he or she was the mom of Whitney Houston. We’ll hear extra after a break. That is FRESH AIR. ****************************
DAVIES: That is FRESH AIR. Let’s get again to Terry’s 1998 interview with gospel and backup singer Cissy Houston. She died Monday on the age of 91.
GROSS: Now, you had an album of your personal within the mid-’70s that has since been reissued. And on this, you have been the lead singer, all secular songs, all cowl recordings. And, in reality, why do not we pause right here and take heed to a canopy you probably did of one in all your niece’s hits?
(LAUGHTER)
GROSS: And that is “I Simply Do not Know What To Do With Myself, ” one of many Burt Bacharach songs. Do you wish to say something about recording this and doing it your method?
C HOUSTON: Nicely, I at all times – I simply appreciated the music. All the time did. And there was no sort of cause to cowl it however I simply – besides that I simply appreciated the music and wished to strive it one other method.
GROSS: Why do not we hear it? And that is from the mid-’70s, Cissy Houston.
C HOUSTON: Nice.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “I JUST DON’T KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH MYSELF”)
C HOUSTON: (Singing) Someone. Will not you assist me? Someone. ‘Trigger I do not know what to do with myself. Simply do not know what to do with myself. I am so used to doing every part with you, planning every part for 2. However now that we’re via, I do not know what to do. I do not know what to do with myself. I am so lonesome for you, I may cry. Going to a film solely makes me really feel dangerous. Events make me really feel so unhappy ‘trigger I am not with you. I do not know what to do. No, no. no. Like a summer season rose.
GROSS: That is Cissy Houston from a secular album that she made within the mid-’70s. Now, the place have been you in your profession when your daughter, Whitney Houston, was born?
C HOUSTON: I used to be just about doing lots – an excessive amount of backgrounds. In actual fact, I used to be within the studio the night time earlier than I went to the hospital.
GROSS: What have been you recording?
C HOUSTON: I do not know what we have been recording. We have been recording – I used to be placing on any person – I think about it was for Aretha or any person like that. And Tom Dowd, who was the engineer at that time, stated, Cissy, are you all proper? Are you all proper? Are you – I stated, tremendous. Come on. Roll the tape. They usually have been nervous. They have been a nervous wreck.
(LAUGHTER)
GROSS: Nicely, it should have been onerous to take these huge, deep breaths it’s essential sing while you have been, you recognize, prepared to provide beginning.
(LAUGHTER)
C HOUSTON: Not likely. You do not even give it some thought, you recognize? I used to be singing like a mockingbird once I was pregnant.
GROSS: So while you turned a mom and also you have been on the street lots, you recognize, in recording studios and, I suppose, doing a little performing as properly, when did you resolve to return off the street?
C HOUSTON: Nicely, it simply – I actually received drained. I received uninterested in listening to my youngsters cry, Mommy, why do you must go? Da, da, da, da. And I had determined that I’d do one thing else on my own.
GROSS: What?
C HOUSTON: And – properly, I used to be changing into an artist in my very own proper, and I had a possibility to take action. And that is once I left the Candy Inspirations and have become a single artist as a result of I used to be the oldest one of many group, they usually wished to do different issues. They wished to put on issues that I did not really feel like I’d – may afford to try this with my three youngsters and representing my, you recognize? So I made a decision…
GROSS: You wish to give us an instance of what you imply?
C HOUSTON: No.
GROSS: No. OK.
C HOUSTON: No, not likely – simply garments that, you recognize, did not develop into me.
GROSS: Proper.
C HOUSTON: That is all.
GROSS: When did you notice that Whitney may actually sing?
C HOUSTON: I suppose she was – should have been round 11 when she actually sang her first solo, and it was nice. She – earlier than that, she at all times appreciated to follow within the basement of some sort, and he or she beloved to bop and issues like that. And I used to take her with me on a regular basis, so she was uncovered to that sort of, you recognize, issues. And she or he was good at what she did, you recognize? However then, at 11, I feel that is once I actually realized that she actually may sing. And I by no means did take into consideration her having a future in it till she determined that that is what she wished to do. I believed she was going to be a veterinarian.
(LAUGHTER)
GROSS: And while you realized that she wished to sing professionally, did you attempt to encourage or discourage her?
C HOUSTON: Nicely, I attempted to inform her of the – all of the negatives, you recognize? And there have been so many positives additionally. But it surely’s your selections that you just make.
GROSS: Should you do not thoughts my asking, your talking voice in the present day sounds somewhat raspy. Your singing…
C HOUSTON: Yeah.
GROSS: …Voice sounds actually full and clear.
C HOUSTON: Yeah.
GROSS: Does your voice sort of change through the day, or is your singing voice and your talking voice totally different, or…
C HOUSTON: It is totally different.
GROSS: It is totally different.
C HOUSTON: Sure. All people’s at all times so shocked once I sing so excessive, proper?
GROSS: Oh, yeah.
C HOUSTON: (Laughter) And my voice is so – actually low. Such as you stated, it is raspy. And – however I’m drained. I’ve a chilly, in order that’s in all probability why. I am often not this raspy.
GROSS: Proper. OK. OK. And what’s it like so that you can sing in a variety that is totally different out of your talking vary? Has it at all times been that method, or…
C HOUSTON: Yeah. It is at all times been that method.
GROSS: Even while you have been a lady, you have been singing larger than you have been talking.
C HOUSTON: I used to be a contralto once I was a child – very low voice, very low, very deep and pronounced, you recognize? It was great, like an organ. And I at all times wished to sing excessive, so to develop my vary, that is what I did. I did it scales and stored going up and up. You understand what I am saying?
GROSS: Proper. I feel a number of listeners, once they hear, say, an Aretha Franklin file, act as if they’re one of many backup singers (laughter) singing alongside. It is really, I feel, a lifelong fantasy of lots of people to have been – I suppose, to have been you in a method – to have been the backup singer on Aretha’s information. And I am questioning, like, do you sing backups while you hear a kind of information performed again, say, in a restaurant…
C HOUSTON: On a regular basis.
GROSS: …Or one thing?
C HOUSTON: On a regular basis. In actual fact, quite than study the lead elements, I am often doing the background, you recognize?
GROSS: (Laughter).
C HOUSTON: In my home or no matter, you recognize? I feel that is essentially the most – they made a number of the file sound. You understand, the background was most necessary.
GROSS: It certain was. Do you will have a favourite of all of the information you’ve got sung backups on?
C HOUSTON: I suppose I like that one, “Pure Girl.” I like “Preacher Man” by Dusty Springfield. And I did a few Whitney’s. I beloved all of these (laughter).
GROSS: Oh, I suppose I ought to have realized that. You are doing the backups on Whitney’s information.
C HOUSTON: A few of them, yeah. “I Need To Dance With Someone” and “How Will I Know” and ones of – oh, I overlook the title of the opposite one. It was a gradual one about her man – “My Man” – no matter. Yeah.
GROSS: That should have felt good.
C HOUSTON: It felt very, excellent. It felt odd, you recognize? I am doing the backup on my child’s – my child’s file, you recognize? And it was nice. It was nice.
GROSS: Nicely, I wish to thanks very a lot for speaking with us.
C HOUSTON: It is my pleasure. And thanks for having me.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “HOW WILL I KNOW?)
WHITNEY HOUSTON: (Singing) How will I do know? Do not belief your emotions. How will I do know? How will I do know? Love could be deceiving. How will I do know? How will I do know if he actually loves me? I say a prayer with each heartbeat. I fall in love at any time when we meet. I am asking you ‘trigger you recognize about this stuff. How will I do know if he is pondering of me?
DAVIES: Cissy Houston spoke with Terry Gross in 1998. She died Monday on the age of 91. After a break, we’ll hear an excerpt of my 2004 interview with baseball’s Pete Rose, who died final week, and David Bianculli opinions a brand new movie in regards to the first episode of “Saturday Evening Stay.” I am Dave Davies, and that is FRESH AIR.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “HE IS THE MUSIC”)
C HOUSTON: (Singing) I’m a singer. I am however one voice. I sing to free myself, to let my soul rejoice. He’s my ardour. He’s my gentle. He retains all hope alive and watches via the night time. We’re His youngsters. We’re actually blessed. We shout to all who’ll hear we’ll equal in a check.
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